Classic 2CV Racing Club Ltd

Classic 2CV Racing Club Ltd Forum => 24h-Race => Topic started by: Chris Yates on August 26, 2015, 21:02:59



Title: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Chris Yates on August 26, 2015, 21:02:59
Please could you all complete the attached feedback form, which will give valuable data to help determine the future direction of the club.

Return the form as an email attachment to caryl.wills@tesco.net


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Chris Yates on August 26, 2015, 21:04:16
Also if you DIDN'T enter the 24 hour race this year, it would be valuable to the club if you can let us know why. Again, send an email to the address as above, or post here if you would rather share.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Chris Yates on September 01, 2015, 10:09:24
In case you can't download the above - here's the form in text format:

Elim Citroen 2CV 24 Hour Race Anglesey Circuit, August 22-23 2015 - Event Feedback Sheet

The Classic 2CV Racing Club, working with Anglesey Circuit and BARC and the title sponsors, Elim Motors, are keen to get your views on your experience of the Elim Citroen 2CV 24 Hour race.  We would appreciate it you would take a moment to read and complete this sheet.

Please copy the text of this post into an editor (such as Notepad), make comments or just give a number, and then email the document to caryl.wills@tesco.net
Or, press the print button, complete the form on paper, then scan and send to the above email address.

Indicate why you were at the race:  Spectator / Official / Marshal / Race driver / Team crew / Other (delete as appropriate)

After each question, please write 1, 2 or 3.  (1 Good    2 Average     3 Poor)
If you would like to comment, please write below the questions - We greatly value frank opinions and ideas.


Spectator experience:
  • Advance information about the event:
  • Parking / viewing:
  • Did you take a look at the Citroen cars?  Y  N
  • PA / Circuit radio / webcast:
  • Viewing access to pit garages:
  • Camping facilities:
  • Catering:


Competitors and team crew experience:
  • Race date:
  • General organisation:
  • Pit garage space and facilities:
  • Toilets & showers:
  • After-race entertainment:


Officials & marshals experience:
  • How do the facilities compare with other circuits?:
  • Is travelling distance an issue?:
  • How can we improve the event?:


What did you enjoy best about the event?


What aspects of the event could be improved?


Would you come back next year?   Yes        Maybe       No  

Thank you for taking the time to complete this survey. Your feedback is valued and very much appreciated.  
Please email to: caryl.wills@tesco.net.
If you would like us to contact you to discuss any issue, please put your name and phone number and/or  email here:


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Maxx on March 07, 2016, 15:31:14

Team Iceni haven't done any 24hr races since it moved to Angelsey and won't be in the future but would sign up in a shot, with 2 x teams if it came back to Snetterton.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: nick nice toes on March 07, 2016, 21:35:17
What is it about a 24hr at anglesey that people are opposed to ???
Having driven both circuits I can only assume it's the travelling that puts people off.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Derek Coghill on March 08, 2016, 12:05:45
Anglesey's about half-an-hour closer for me.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Louis on March 09, 2016, 15:00:37
What is it about a 24hr at anglesey that people are opposed to ???
Having driven both circuits I can only assume it's the travelling that puts people off.

Agreed, I much prefer Anglesey... What is it that will stop people racing at Anglesey, is it the circuit or the traveling?


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Scooterman on March 09, 2016, 15:42:40
Anglesey is by far and away the better track to drive. Great circuit, beautiful location. However, for most teams its logistically challenging, getting people to help etc. Also the weather is often.... Well let's say it's Welsh. I remember one guy saying "If you can't see Snowdonia it's raining, if you can it's about to rain". Driving in the wet is fun, but it isn't fun those in helping in the paddock. I know there where some horribly wet 24hrs at Snetterton, but on average the weather is always going to be worse at Trac Mon.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: barney rubble on March 21, 2016, 12:47:43
I think you will find its not all about the distance and the logistics alot of people out there prefer the bank holiday weekend, as a mechanic and not a arrive a drive driver it takes alot of time out of your life and the extra day for the bank holiday helped alot,also the schedulde for this years race is not good with start times this is so the circuit can have a track day on the sunday this must be all about greed as the cost to race has gone up!! so all that attend have a great time but count me out


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Louis on March 22, 2016, 11:47:51
I think you will find its not all about the distance and the logistics alot of people out there prefer the bank holiday weekend, as a mechanic and not a arrive a drive driver it takes alot of time out of your life and the extra day for the bank holiday helped alot,also the schedulde for this years race is not good with start times this is so the circuit can have a track day on the sunday this must be all about greed as the cost to race has gone up!! so all that attend have a great time but count me out


Valuable answer which we need to consider in future, if you can't get support for your car, you can't run and it's unreasonable to expect non-drivers to give up precious holiday.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: gadget on March 22, 2016, 20:29:17
without doubt it is a problem getting people to angelsey. it is the other end of the world.
to get them there the weekend before a bank holiday is worse than persuading Mike Fox to clean his camper!
if the facilities were really good it might be easier.
starting at 9am?? well I suppose we don't need any facilities, well not in the bar anyway.
I thought this meeting was a social weekend as well as a racing weekend? it always has been
not only is it going to be dangerous going into the night having done several hours, it is also going to be a bit early to go into beer o'clock at nine on sunday morning!
someone somewhere obviously knows a bit more about 24 hour racing that all those who have been doing it before.
Le Mans has a lot to learn.
G


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Maisie on March 22, 2016, 22:18:48
It might be at the end of the world for some, but not for others (ourselves included). On the flipside, some of you have been lucky enough to have the race practically on the doorstep for a decade and are now feeling exactly what the rest of us have done all that time ... but we still considered the event worth making the effort for. The roads to Anglesey are probably no worse than getting stuck in Elveden for the 8th time on the way to Snet. At least it's dual carriageway and upwards most of the way.

I don't think Anglesey has the same atmosphere as Snetterton. One of my major gripes is that the small doors in the garage rollers mean that it's easy to close the big door and effectively shut the garage off from the rest of the paddock. I always loved being able to walk the fire lane at Snetterton, see into the garages (even if it was blowing a gale with sideways rain, which is the downside...) and share a smile or a wave with people inside. And when you're on catering etc duty in the awnings, it's nice to be able to see how the guys in the garage are doing.

I really don't like the idea of the 9am finish. The post-race social has always been a big part of the event and a chance for an end-of-season get-together. I can see the attraction to the circuit to run another event on the Sunday to keep costs down (although I do wonder how much is warranted economically and how much is a little greedy) and to non-racers to get home at a reasonable time on Sunday afternoon/evening. A return to the days when there used to be a meeting on the Saturday at Snet before the race could be a compromise. I know that the other racers on the Saturday were intrigued by our racing and those that stayed over on the Saturday night enjoyed it. It's a great opportunity to showcase the club and the 24hr race. If we can't do that, I think the club needs to seriously look at subsidising racing even if just for one year to get numbers back up as things are looking pretty bad at the moment :(

Having said that.... if we have to finish at 9am, how about a beach BBQ if the weather's good enough??


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Alec Graham on March 23, 2016, 15:30:29
If the track day or whatever it is that is booked for the sunday was moved to the Saturday. that would be better. giving us a 6pm ish start to 6pmish sunday


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Trevor Williams on March 23, 2016, 16:20:35
But with no time to qualify on the Saturday.....

You would probably struggle to get most other championships to make the journey to Anglesey for a one day meeting, and that's all they would get.

Track hire costs are only going one way, upwards.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: naughtybear on March 23, 2016, 16:22:01
Free practice/ quali Friday race start Saturday late afternoon as Alec says


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Lien93 on March 23, 2016, 17:23:11
We could not be further away from the original proposal that we were sold regarding switching to Anglesey in the first place. It has gone from bad to worse. it's not a bank holiday weekend, it's not cheaper, the facilities are much worse, it's a great deal further for the Belgians to get to, and now the race timing is a joke! Without being completely negative, I do like the track (but it does cost a lot more in tyres) and I think the viewing is much better.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Steve Panas on March 23, 2016, 20:18:22
 ;DYou won't need to do the 24 as the championship should be won before!!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Simon Crook on March 23, 2016, 22:27:17
We could not be further away from the original proposal that we were sold regarding switching to Anglesey in the first place. It has gone from bad to worse. it's not a bank holiday weekend, it's not cheaper, the facilities are much worse, it's a great deal further for the Belgians to get to, and now the race timing is a joke! Without being completely negative, I do like the track (but it does cost a lot more in tyres) and I think the viewing is much better.
that is a very valid point Lien, I had not given the additional travel that our Belgium racers now have to make, would be interesting to find out their thoughts on Anglesey - Although I probably won't be around, I have to say that I do think the start and finish times will do us any favours, I understand why its been done. 


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Nick Roads on March 26, 2016, 08:57:02
Reading this thread then I can add a couple of points. I only helped this year in liaising with Euros and minis and not privy to all the options and considerations but my take on it all is:

Snetterton wanted a lot more money 2 years ago (20% + increase on 2013) which was one of the reasons for the switch. They are still more expensive I believe and have made no effort to get us back to my knowledge since the move. There are a couple of other series doing endurance racing at Snetterton that I can see but their entry fees for 6 -9 hours similar to ours for 24 Hours.

I do not like the new timings for the 24 Hour race from a personal point of view but August for weekend trackdays is good business for the circuit and there was little appetite I believe to take the risk of paying an extra 10,000 to have the circuit all weekend if it did not actually get greater numbers to the event. 

The Belgians much prefer Anglesey to Snetterton which I was surprised to hear after 2014 and repeated last year. Better to drive and better for the pit crews was the feedback. They will like the new timings I would have thought as well but not told them yet as decision was made without asking them. The minis prefer the new timings they tell me and also prefer Anglesey for endurance racing - they do a lot more races weekends in a year.



Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Alec Graham on March 26, 2016, 17:39:32
The 24 hour race isn't at my local or favourite circuit. I don't like the timings. I don't like the race being multi class.
These are my opinions. I don't think they warrant much sway and I don't expect them to.

What does warrant sway are a few facts.

Last year the club attracted 20 uk spec cars to the grid. The season opener this year at Oulton park attracted 17cars to the grid.
When the club has so few attendees , how can you expect it to be able to have choice. The club is effectively struggling for survival and we frankly should feel very fortunate that we still have a 24 hour race at all.
motor racing is very popular and 24 hour endurance racing is more popular than it used to be. Circuit costs for 24 hour events will therefore only go one way.
Last year a few of us did a bit of digging around and found 80 uk spec cars in more or less raceworthy condition. We have no future if we lock them away and wait until the venue and the start time are most convenient.
Our only way forward here is to support the club, attend the meetings and ensure the club is financially healthy. Only then can the club have choice.
Perhaps a way forward with a well supported race would be a time when the board might be able to offer a choice of venues and weekends(with costs) at the agm. Im sure this would be a happier board than a board trying constantly to find a way for the club to survive.


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: wilbot on March 27, 2016, 14:00:18
As a new boy a lot of the replies to the feedback are a bit worrying. I worked hard to produce a car that was up to scratch and didn't need towing back during it,s and my initial runs. I to noticed the thin grid at Oulton and the lack of new cars. The thinness being added to by MSV / BARC not being on top of organising the paddock so that the various marques are grouped together - a small thing I know but it's pretty obvious that when there is a test day before a meeting a lot are going to stay over and set up for the weekend a parking marshal would help ? you pay top dollar for testing days & racing.
Getting back to the point members are thinning no doubt due to costs or moving up to faster classes after years of GB spec 2CV's.No harm in that in fact more potential for expanding the club handled properly  I say this as a total beginner in 2CV's. The point is to make the club more attractive to beginners and long terms racers alike. I certainly intend to compete in the 24 hour.
Perhaps encouraging some of the drivers of the "80" cars to come out and play or put them on the market to encourage newcomers might help, A campaign for beginners needs to start soon it's a years job to sort out your finances get a used car revamp and cross the hurdles to start, ARDS test and so on.
I say all this with no prejudice only the hope to see the club grow stronger.
Lastly I much appreciate the help and encouragement I have had so far so don't want to stain that by writing life as I see it             


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Martin Harrold on March 28, 2016, 14:59:55
Maisie:

That's a very good point about the garage pedestrian doors. You may recall that last year we put notices on every door, inviting spectators to walk in. We also hired little barriers to encourage teams to leave a viewing area clear inside the door. Those were a mixed success.

Frankly, it's a lot to do with the wind and the rain.

With the enforced 9am start, the networking/social side of the 24 Hour will not be what it was. We are stuck with it for this year, so if anyone has any practical and positive ideas for improving the social / spectator experience, please post them here and all will be considered.

To generate enough extra revenue to rent the circuit for a third day, I believe we would need either 40 cars on the grid, or an extra 500 from every car with 28 cars on the grid. Neither are very workable options. Or we find some people who want to pay lots to share the circuit with us during the parts of the three days that we don't need.  Anyone any ideas on that? Harley-Davidson owners club - perhaps?



Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Trevor Williams on March 30, 2016, 12:14:10
The cost of circuit hire is only going one way.... upwards!
If the club wants the circuit to themselves, it will cost more as there is no other series / championship to share the costs.
I would be very surprised if the organising club would be interested in turning the circuit over to a another entity to run a track day on the Saturday to allow the race to start later. I would also be surprised if the marshals would want to hang about for the day whilst this happened. I, for one, would not want to be hanging around if I was one of the Clerks
Previously, at Snetterton, other races championships were on the bill. Why is this not the case at Anglesey?


Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Nick Roads on March 30, 2016, 16:12:01
wilbot - don't panic on numbers they vary year to year
In 2010 there were only 17 cars entered at Oulton, in 2009 it was 18 cars etc.

trevor - Anglesey has always been a difficult circuit for sprint races apparently due to distance etc. BARC could not find other series willing to pay anything close to the 10,000 for the extra day. What seems to have changed is that the track day companies increasingly like weekends and this was a reason given for the increase in prices or the demand to start early on Saturday so they could rent out on Sunday. Snetterton, apparently,  wanted more than 10,000 more than AC via BARC and also would be split over 3 days so no advantage there. 




Title: Re: 24hr feedback requested
Post by: Suzanne P on May 07, 2016, 20:05:41
I don't understand why people are so afraid of Anglesey. The A55 is an excellent road, Anglesey has modern shops (24 Hour Tesco's nearby and other supermarkets are available), restaurants, communications, a dual carriageway and plenty of places if you wanted to make a holiday of it.  The circuit is aware of the WIFI problem and are trying to rectify it.

No we can't help the weather but Snetterton had problems too - red flags in the night thanks to fog, things floating off down the pitlane and lakes forming in the middle of the camping area.

What can the Club do to increase spectators? I'm currently surveying my pals on Facebook to try and find out the wider issues concerning spectators at motorsport events.