The 24 Hour at Spa Francochamps is 15-16 October. Race Start expected to be around 4pm on Saturday.
UK 2CV's can run as UK hybrid or as Classic 2CV race specification or as Economy class. Drivers will need National A licences and have to pay day membership for 2CVRT which is 25 Euros. There is normally 1 hour of testing included on the Friday and then teams have to pay for extra testing time on the Friday.
For those who have entered the UK 24 Hour race the entry fee should be around £ 1600. The classic mini's will be racing with the other UK cars in their 1275cc specification as last year which is similar in performance to UK hybrid. I would expect to have final prices and details mid August.
If anyone wants more information then email me
[email protected].
(http://www.24h2cv.be/images/intro/Banner_Petit2016v2.jpg)
The final details still to be confirmed by 2CVRT in Belgium but key points are:
If teams pay £ 500 deposit by September 1 then, assuming the pound does not collapse, the total fee will be just under £ 1600.
If there are more than 10 entries, including the mini 1275, there will be an approx £ 50 reduction on final payment which is due by October 1 for those who pay by Sept 1.
10 teams, including the minis, have said they are going and a couple of others considering it which I know about.
5 drivers maximum. *added - Drivers must have Race National A licences NOT National B
25 euros per driver for membership of RACB (belgian racing club) which can be made on the final payment in £ once we know the exchange rate or in cash at Spa
There is a mandatory deposit of 500 Euros payable to the circuit per car in cash on arrival - covers items like not damaging the garages. I have not known anyone not get this back.
HANS devise is not required..
Its 2 cars per garage in the old F1 pits - very cramped and let me know about any sharing requirements etc
The race is due to start at 1200 not 1600. Means teams could make ferries back on Sunday. Its around 4 hours from Calais.
Qualifying will be on the Saturday so no night qualifying and it is not a requirement, nor indeed possible on 4 minute laps, for all drivers to do qualifying
There should be testing on Friday for at least 1 hour as part of the entry fee and extra time can be bought closer to the event or on the day on the Friday. This can be expensive - last year it cost 600 euros to test all day. This reflects the general test day costs for the circuit are very high and 2CVRT have similar battles to the UK Club with trying to keep costs down eg typical test day: http://spa-francorchamps.be/en/test-days (http://spa-francorchamps.be/en/test-days)
I am trying to find out about mezzanines which are above the garages and can easily accommodate 40 people and have a kitchen, tables, timing screens are cosy and warm etc. In previous years teams have shared them but are not cheap - over 1600 Euros for the weekend split between the teams that share. If interested in sharing let me know
To make the first payment, entry form and for any other questions more details please email me
6 September Update:
Might have got the team numbers wrong but all teams below paid and displayed deposit - thanks. £ 1600 + drivers + testing as in other posts for any further entries. Awaiting final details and testing prices etc
UK 2CV (602cc) :
MIM Racing 1 - Car 89
MIM Racing 2 - Car 32
Jelly Snake Racing - Car 23
Roise Racing - Car 222
UK 2CV (BMW 1100 Hybrid):
Crisis Too - Car 36
Crisis Fore - Car 52
Tete Rouge - Car 40
Gadget Racing - Car 56
UK Mini (1275 cc)
Team Toyshed - Car 73
Slarky Malarky - Car 28
Maxted Racing - Car 44 or 144
There is another Mini team expected to enter
The Belgians were interested in the C1's and are proposing to allow them to enter in the 2016 race in their own class. It needs approval from their National organisation which will be known in a few days. The 2 Rent Boys C1's expected to go if so and there have been enquiries for 2 Dutch cars and 1 based in Germany to race under the UK C1 regulations.
Nick, do you know what the situation is with transponders? I.e. can we use UK transponders or will we have to hire one from them?
Hi Chris
They seem to vary each year as to transponders - 2014 we were ok with UK ones, last year we had to rent them. They supply portable battery powered units with a cradle that goes on the roll cage inside the car - they rent them for around 25 euros. I will try and find out if we are ok with ours.
Created a bulletin for the entered team managers earlier this week as attached, of interest for anyone toying with a later entry or thinking of next year. Includes details on testing on Friday.
Since then another mini entered - Misfits who have been at Anglesey for the last few years. Race numbers changing for a few teams since then Jelly Snake now 231.
So should be 16 + UK teams in various classes.
Nick
Couple of things in your briefing note need clarifying.
Roll Cage Protection / foam. Last year Tete Rouge "just" got away with the foam not being the FIA approved stuff. I would advise all to make sure they have some FIA roll cage foam just in case
Snell 2005 Helmets. Both my helmets are Snell 2005 with the FIA HANS device sticker (HANS posts fixed by the manufacturer). I had no problem with them being scrutineered last year. The problems I saw were in relation to British Standards helmets, which became unapproved on 1st January 2015. Snell 2005 + FIA Hans has no "removal" date in the latest FIA technical list, and Snell 2005 without hans goes out of date in 2018 according to the FIA.
Cheers
Nick
Just read the Tech Regs (5.6) for the 2CVRT and they clearly allow Snell 2005 (until 31/12/2018), Snell SAH 2010 and Snell 2010 along with FIA 8860-2004 and FIA 8860-2010. Could get interesting if anyone has a Snell 2015 or FIA 8859-2015 helmet!!
Cheers
Trevor
Having had to buy 2 helmets at Spa it can be expensive having the wrong one.
5 years ago was in the Burton and told to get closed face helmet by the team when I got their on Friday night and discovered car was open top! I googled the pros and cons overnight of using open face helmet and when I read that the last British driver to die at Spa had been killed by a bird hitting him in the face decided discretion was the better part of valour.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Stacey (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Stacey)
The Burton team kindly took me to the other side of Spa on Saturday morning to save 400 euros on the price from the man in the van at the circuit.
2 years later both helmets were 'out of date' at scrutinering for first race in my 2CV. They were both ok for testing. We had an hour until qualifying so off to the man in the van to pay 500 euros..
That man in the van at the circuit makes a fortune every year!!
Hoping to get along to spectate this year, can you (I) park up a small motorhome in the pits or do I have to go with those public people!
Likewise - I'm bringing a caravan, which I'd like to park relatively close to the pits (down the bottom of the hill I guess) - is that ok?
This is 1 of the reasons why having the F1 pits would make more sense in my opinion.
There are a lot of vehicles going and there just isn't the space behind the old pits to accommodate everybod .
I've rented a whole house in Coo from a mate, which is about 3km from Francorchamps. I may have some spaces available - if anyone is interested, let me know: it will work out at about €30 a night sharing a room, including breakfast.
You can park in the pit area and camp up, you need a team pass to get in though I think.
The field is epic, the atmosphere is totally unbeatable and there's hard standing for campers at the bottom, opposite the police station.
Quote from: Simon Crook on September 26, 2016, 17:14:45
Hoping to get along to spectate this year, can you (I) park up a small motorhome in the pits or do I have to go with those public people!
Useful info, thank you. I've just applied for a press pass so will keep my lens focused for UK cars :)
UK 2CV (602cc) :
MIM Racing 1 - Car 89
MIM Racing 2 - Car 32
Jelly Snake Racing - Car 23
Roise Racing - Car 222
UK 2CV (BMW 1100 Hybrid):
Crisis Too - Car 36
Crisis Fore - Car 52
Tete Rouge - Car 40
Gadget Racing - Car 56
UK Mini (1275 cc)
Team Toyshed - Car 73
Slarky Malarky - Car 28
Maxted Racing - Car 44 or 144
There is another Mini team expected to enter
Yes, F1 pits would be nice.
Quote from: nick nice toes on September 26, 2016, 21:56:28
This is 1 of the reasons why having the F1 pits would make more sense in my opinion.
There are a lot of vehicles going and there just isn't the space behind the old pits to accommodate everybod .
I read the sporting regs (http://www.24h2cv.be/2CVRT/Documents/reglement_sport_techn/2CV%20Racing%20Cup%202016%20-%20Reglement%20Sportif.pdf) a little last night, and a few things sprang out at me:
Do we need to bring 2, 9kg powder fire extinguishers? :
5.5
Each team must provide 2 powder extinguishers 9kg minimum valid and order operation and by hired vehicle. These extinguishers shall be presented to a member officer of the organization.
Couple of other "interesting" things that people should be aware of, unless I'm reading these wrong:
9.2
Each manager Team and all drivers must attend to the various briefings for the duration of these and sign the attendance sheet, on pain of a penalty Financial 100 €
The maximum duration of consecutive driving one pilot (stops included) can not exceed three hours.
After three hours of running a one-hour break is mandatory.
b) When the order is given to use the Code 60 during the race, all monitoring stations
will present purple flags or signs with the indication '60', which will be maintained until the end of
the procedure. All vehicles shall immediately reduce speed to 60 km / h maximum, the
overtaking will be banned.
(you should be aware of what revs makes 60km/h)
16.1
During the pit stop, maximum 4 people can intervene directly on the vehicle. People helping the driver to fasten the harness are not included in these 4 people. The mechanics must at least wear overalls, which protects against fire from heat, fire and possible injury. Shorts is prohibited
(Those are just people doing work on the car. Note that it doesn't say "flame-retardant" overalls. Just overalls.)
16.9
Transport fuel: Inside the paddock and pits, fuel transportation can not do that in jerrycans stamped by the technical control. Jerrycans transported must be secured to the transporting vehicle. Fuel transportation attendants must be provided,
throughout the operation, a powder extinguisher 9 kg minimum, valid and in order operation
16.13
While refueling will take place in the special area provided for this purpose. When refueling takes place in the pit area, the driver change will be during it, but no further action will be permitted. Someone more outgoing driver can help the driver used to be equipped with seatbelts.
16.14
For the duration of the supply, the presence of the officer and his fire extinguisher. All supplies can be made at the beginning or end of a pit stop. The car must stay on its wheels during the course of refueling.
16.15
The driver may remain in his car throughout refueling but the engine must be stopped and the belt buckle open safety
16.16
The team leader must ensure that a mechanic with a valid extinguisher and serviceable operation (minimum capacity: 5 kg) is at least 2 meters and a maximum of 4 meters the car filling orifice throughout the refueling operation and that all
refueling staff, two mechanics maximum, specifically designated for this surgery. Each carries a flame retardant combination, a fireproof balaclava, fireproof shoes, solid and closed, flame retardant gloves and goggles or a helmet.
16.17
The attendant device "dead man" will not be counted in the staff performing the refueling.
16.19
The driver must halt the vehicle at the traffic light with access to the track. The attendant at the exit pit lane identifies the driver at the wheel, check the CT stickers and gives the signal the resumption of the track
(every time?)
I can only comment on 1 of the mentioned rules.
Yes I have received a bollocking for working on the car in my shorts.
As i remember but maybe wrong
you have to have your name on your helmet (lefthand side) and stop at the end of pit lane every pit stop so marshals can note your name.
Refueling is the oppersit of here driver can be in the car but nothing else can be done on the car till refueling is complete
5.5 Yes, you must have 2 extinguishers per vehicle, including 1 for refueling
9.2 There are 3 essential briefings: the sporting checks (licenses, etc.), technical checks (conformity of 2CV) and briefing of pilots
Maximum of 3 hours, including "code 60", penalties, etc. Minimum break of 1 hour for each driver
Tip: When you are in "code 60" (maximum speed = 37 mi / h), the checks are random with radar and systematic with stopwatch: you must not run a lap in less than 7 minutes
16.1 The refueling staff (1 refueling man + 1 extinguisher man) must wear flame-retardant overall. Mechanics must have legs and arms covered.
16.9 When you go refuel jerrycans to the Total station, you must be 2 mechanics, including 1 with extinguisher
16.13 While refueling 2CV, the only permitted action is the driver change, with the help of only 1 mechanics (in addition to two pilots)
16.19 Yes, every time :) The best is to have your name written in big, and to turn your head to the attendant well read the name and see your bracelet on your left wrist.
Even say your name out loud to get the green light soon (Then write your name both on front and left side for the right-hand drive ?)
Best regards,
Marty (#172 not yet fully repaired)
Thanks Marty (hope you get your "Herbie" back on track soon!)
Buying fuel: Do we have a 'fuel card' like we do at Anglesey? Or is there some other system?
Petrol pump is a pay pump.
Just pay on your card at the pump.
So no fuel card required.
Tell your card company what you are doing or you may end up like Papa Mick the other year where his card was blocked.
Seem to remember they were not very happy with other Nick's footwear one year either however nice the toes were..
Code 60 was strictly enforced and they issued over 20 drive through's last year
May be repeating but some other points:
Seat must be within 5 years
Jubilee clamp to go round fire extinguisher
Roll cage needs protecting where head might hit it in case it gets damaged in a crash
On the roll cage padding, they also tend to enforce FIA-spec padding rather than the usual plumbers foam
Code 60: When the flags/boards come out it's 60km/h immediately (how many revs is that in a UK 602?)
BUT, when the flags are taken in, can you resume racing as soon as you see a green flag, or do you have to cross the start/finish line first?
Definitely fia padding. The hard stuff. We blagged it for a few years but then fitted the fia stuff and they were soo delighted.
Although as we run to UK rules some have got away with it , same applies to the front indicators not working.
60 KPH is approx. 3000 to 3100 rpm in top, not sure about lower gears
Flat out in 1st Chris ;D :D
Alternatively a kitchen timer or similar to time your lap.
The end of the Code 60 is when you PASS a green flag, not when you SEE a green flag.
They use them a lot for the VLN / RCN series at the Nirburgring because the track is so narrow; and they have clarified this in presentations over and over again for us. I'll try and get hold of one and post it.
Meyrick,
That may be how the VLN run it, but that is not how the ISC reads. It is also not how the Blue Book will read next year. The whole point of the Code 60 / Full Course Yellow is to neutralise the race and stabilise positions. Racing restarts on the display of the green flag, not when you pass a flag point as the display is simultaneous at all points after a countdown from Race Control
Probably best to confirm exactly what the rule is in the driver's briefing
Cheers
Trevor,
Sorry, I wasn't clear. You're absolutely right on a full course yellow / Code 60; but on the continent (and it worked like this in both the Spa 6-hour and 24-hour this year) they also have partial Code 60s, just for a particular area. You're right, I should have distinguished between the two as follows:
In a full course Code 60, you can go as soon as you see the green flag, no need to wait to pass it. They should appear simultaneously around the course.
If there is a partial Code 60 - let's say just in the area of the Bus Stop - you have to wait until you have passed the green flag to accelerate, not when you see it.
I'll make sure to ask in the drivers' briefing whether they will operate both or just full course Code 60s
Best MC
Meyrick
The 2CVRT Regs don't differentiate on Code 60. It is to the whole course (unless the organisers issue some further supplementary regs for the event). Safety cars are another matter as they run two as Spa is over 7km in length (just...) It probably needs clarifying as to when a driver can overtake after the safety car comes in (immediately (don't think so) or after the passing the green flag /light at the next flag point (More than likely))
Cheers
May I put a fly in the ointment ?
If there is 18 british teams (including C1 ::)), the price for each is £1550
Said otherwise, the six C1 will pay (10000€) just over the amount than two Classic 2CV (9000€)...
Pity :'(
One other thing that competitors should do....
Make sure that you have a copy of the MSA Start Permission letter with you. Even though your licence states that it is valid under the relevant ISC article, you are advised to carry a copy with you....
Quote from: Marty on October 12, 2016, 10:51:04
May I put a fly in the ointment ?
If there is 18 british teams (including C1 ::)), the price for each is £1550
Said otherwise, the six C1 will pay (10000€) just over the amount than two Classic 2CV (9000€)...
Pity :'(
If you entered our race that is the sort of discounted price you would pay Marty.Better to have entries than not.
Trevor.
Where can this letter be downloaded from. Is it the msa website.
https://www.msauk.org/assets/2016competingabroaddocument.pdf
Thanks Trevor - I'll make sure to ask at the drivers' briefing.
My photos of the Brits publicly available here: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10157729779655595.1073741861.905420594&type=1&l=3b9745162c (https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10157729779655595.1073741861.905420594&type=1&l=3b9745162c)