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2010 24hr

Started by Geoff Archer, November 09, 2009, 23:12:21

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JonWaldock

Quote from: Andrew Bull on January 06, 2010, 00:01:38

If this was put in to our supplementary regs' for the event, Tape ('gaffer' or otherwise) just does not 'cut the mustard'.  The method would have to be slot in name cards or such.  Have you ever tried to stick tape to a wet, dirty, oil and petrol stained car. 


I think we need some input from the Dutch team, who did this last year, to find out what they used.

You make some good points, and i'll definitely make sure I use the CoC and other such people for this years event. I completely agree about the change sheets though.
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Paul Robertson

Jon ,the teams fill in a driver change form which the marshals hand in to race admin .I assume they must keep a log of who is in the car so they know how long the driver has been in the car(3hr rule)and also in case of an incident .Maybe we can make this accessable to the commentary team. 

philip myatt

What do they at Le Mans?

JonWaldock

Quote from: philip myatt on January 06, 2010, 16:10:39
What do they at Le Mans?

All the names are on hte car, and then name  of the person in the car are on the timing screen.
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Trevor Williams

Andy
You are correct in that the Clerk must ensure that the driver(s) are qualified for that particular car, and also have the responsibility to ensure that no-one does more than three hours without a minimum one hour break between stints. This has previously been done by a BIG piece of paper with the cars down one side and the hours accross the top, and four different coloured highlighter pens under the control of the Secretary of the Meeting in Race Admin. They might use computers now!
If anyone needs / wants to know who was in a car at a particular moment, that is where you would get the info!
Some days, it's REALLY difficult being me!

FastKars


We just used painter's tape to cover the names of the drivers that weren't in the car as other/better tape ruined the vinyl lettering.
The crew made it part of their pit procedure, but nevertheless we did forget it ones (I think).
And...last year, all 24 hrs of the race were completely dry...don't know how the tapes does when it's wet

cheers

ps. when will the official 2010 regs be available?

Steve Panas

Le Mans???  Bit quicker I think. Not much else!!

Martin Harrold

If you look carefully at a Le Mans car you'll see two things:

- the number panel is electro-luminescent, and I think has the race number light out of a dark backround. Such panels list at around £200 each. The refective panels we used in '09 seemed to work very well and I don't think we need to spend £400 or so on lit panels.

- a vertical row of three big dots, on each side. They are lit up depending upon which driver, 1, 2 or 3, is in the car. The operational procedure for that is helped by the fact that each car garage has a race official in it at all times, checking on all sorts of things. Whether the changes are made during the pit-stop or are radio linked in some way, I don't know.
  I think that to have each driver numbered in the programme, and to have the illuminated dots fitted to a couple of the cars would be worth a trial in the 2010 race. There should be plenty of time during the petrol fill for someone to flick a switch or two. The numbering could be set by the team and repeated in the qualifying listing and on signs by each garage.
  We'd be happy to develop something, and with LED's so easily available, there would be limited drain on the electrics. 
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JonWaldock

Quote from: Martin HARROLD on January 08, 2010, 20:47:51
If you look carefully at a Le Mans car you'll see two things:
.....

- a vertical row of three big dots, on each side. They are lit up depending upon which driver, 1, 2 or 3, is in the car.

The lights are actually for you to see if the car you're watching is in the top 3 in class, different lights are lit depending on whether it's 1st, 2nd or 3rd in class, but the idea of numbered drivers does sound good
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Martin Harrold

Jon - thanks - one learns something new every day!

Interesting that the AOC thinks that spectators are more interested in the position of the car in its class than who is actually driving it. And, if it does indicate race positions then it must be radio controlled. Pretty complex.

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Martin Harrold

I've just read Jon's earlier post. Cracking idea that the driver in the car is indicated on the timing screen. I'll talk to TSL about that, for it would be a big help to those following it at the circuit and on the web. Being realistic, any indicator on the car would actually be very hard to read.
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Trevor Williams

Exactly how is the information going to get to the timekeepers?? The race is at Snetterton!! The circuit with the timekeepers OUTSIDE the track!!!! And it still relies on the information that is avaiable in race control!!

The race is great as it is.... a Citroen 2CV 24 Hour Race. Le  Mans we ain't, and I'm glad because the entry fee would be extortionate!

And exactly how many paying spectators does the race attract? Not enough to warrant any additional cost which would be passed on to the competitors via the entry fee!

If it ain't broke, why try to fix it?
Some days, it's REALLY difficult being me!

JonWaldock

Quote from: Trevor Williams on January 09, 2010, 21:01:10
If it ain't broke, why try to fix it?

I get your point, and agree to a certain extent, but why change it? to make it better, no it's not broken but this year was the first year of the webcast with RSL/RLM, there wasn't any need to do it, but i know people who had no idea the event existed and they stayed up for many hours watching and listening to the webcast. This year (as written here by Martin: http://www.2cvracing.org.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1469.0.html) theres a possibility that there may be an increased webcast with multiple camera angles and such, my point being, no it's not broke, but can the event be improved? of course.
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Martin Harrold

I think Trevor and Jon are both right.

It's quite correct that the Club should always be looking to improve the racing and the presentation of the racing for the competitors, the crews and the spectators. Nothing stands still in motor racing. (Sorry, that is a dreadful unintentional pun)

It's also true that we have to be aware of any cost and resource implications of possible changes.

I've had a prompt reply from Tony Daff of TSL, who do the timing, and it's not very encouraging. To have 'driver in' info on the timing screens is done professionally and automatically with special 4 driver transponders, at £450 a go. Drivers just have to turn a switch to their driver number when they get in the car.

To gather and input data manually in some way would be difficult in any case. But as Trev reminds us , with the timing box on the other side of an uncrossable track, it's almost impossible to have the level of communication required to ensure any reasonable level of accuracy of the info on screen.

To have 'driver in' info would be interesting to those who will be following on the webcast, and very helpful to crews planning strategy for their cars. It would also greatly help the commentators.

Maybe a simple solution will be developed, but I'm not too confident. Still, at least the 'on screen' idea will have  been examined.

We can continue to consider some kind of low-tech visual indicators on the cars.



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Nigel Hollis

Just an idea. Speedway riders are identified by a coloured pull-on cover on their helmet. red, blue, white & yellow. Would need to be fireproof of course.Or a coloured patch on the  sides could suffice. Teams would need to notify driver colour before the race. As added interest to other drivers when on the track,  the colour could indicate how the team rate their drivers e.g. red equals driver no.1. etc.